Nick Drake - Ross Grainger interview 30 July 2019

Interview with Ross Grainger, 30 July 2019 

This interview is based on a recorded transcript which began in Anthony Ashbolt’s office, then continued as we walked to the UOW Library, and finally as we sat down at the Panizzi Café in front of the library. The interviewer was Michael Organ. Those also in the conversation included Anthony Ashbolt and Kristy Newton of the Library. 

RG: When I arrived in London I was living in a room below the office of Friends magazine. 

MO: Friends magazine? 

RG: Pete Steedman was around then. He was one of the editors of Friends, with a Z and an S. 

AA: Ross's bookstore was underneath the Friends office. 

MO: Was Richard Neville involved? 

RG: His place with OZ magazine was in Leicester Square. I went there a few times, but particularly when they put out the school kids issue. We can do an interview today but I will take my time. I was working in China and had a stroke two years ago, plus I also have a cold so I'm not a hundred percent. But I was lucky in regard to the stroke because my mental faculties don't seem to be affected. 

AA: Ross was just telling me about his friend Barney Bubbles. 

RG: Yes, he was a friend of mine. He was an artist. 

MO: He did a poster for OZ, but had an unfortunate ending. 

AA: He also did a lot of album covers, such as for Billy Bragg and Hawkwind. 

RG: Barney started off with people like Hawkwind. Have you heard of Phil Frank? He was photographer who often worked with Barney. 

MO: Have you written any biographical material? 

RG: Yes, I wrote the Nick Drake thing that was recently published in Counterculture Studies. I also contributed to a book on him called A Skin Too Few – The Days of Nick Drake. 

AA: Quotes - “In the book Ross Granger describes Drake as a modern Pagan long after his death, recording conversations about Gaia Theory, Stonehenge, Ley lines and supernatural forces.” 

RG: I don't even know how to pronounce Ley line. But yes, that is right. Our conversations were about understanding the interface between landscape history, deep topography and other paths. At the time people didn't talk about the environment very much. Then it was quite a topic of interest with me. 

MO: And did you talk with Nick Drake about the environment at that time? 

RG: Yes. There was that book Silent Sprint by Rachel Carson, from 1962, and I used to sell it and books such about the Gaia Hypothesis in my book shop. 

MO: When you said you talked to Nick, what was he interested in? I understand that he had studied English literature at Cambridge University. You said he also had an interest in the environment? 

RG: Yes. We were interested in things such as King Arthur and Stonehenge and Glastonbury. This is before the music festival which started in 1979. I think the alternate festival, with a few people sitting around playing guitars, start the early in the 70s. I also visited places such as Dartmoor. 

Nick’s music was in many ways unstructured, especially when he performed live. A good example was Riverman, which was different each time he played. He even played much longer versions when he played and I used to write the words down because they weren't the same as on the album Five Leaves Left. 

So what was the exhibition like I was good? It was I'll be here. Let's see. Yeah, well we're going to I enjoyed it but it's just one of those things that I suppose I knew so much. It didn't sort of bowl me over for being I really like the Summer of Love One a bit more in terms of they got the Digger here. I can't remember that cover the beans along with any way you like the Summer of Love running that was in America wasn't yeah, but this was this was just as this was just as thorough it's good. So, I mean there was a lot if you and if you if you weren't as familiar with it, it'll probably it was it was great to be, you know reminded of things but I suppose it's partly because I've been too Y'all went to the summer of love one another and there was something about Oh, no, look our work. And this one is is good. And also the catalog you seen the you saying oh, yes. Yeah. It's like which I've had so we've had so you knew it. Is it really it's terrific. It's a fabulous catalog. I wish I'd come up. I wish they'd come up to room Wong up the Sydney. I mean, yeah, well, maybe it was yet. Look it was well worth going to and then because at the National Gallery there was not only the Terracotta Warriors which were conjoined with this. I'm in adjacent to conjoined with us. But this contemporary Chinese artists work with terracotta and others which absolutely fabulous all these birds and so on like a ceiling full of Starlings and just extraordinary stuff and really but but also the other exhibition is Alexander Calder and his his Mobile's And he was a friend of and 0 in the day. It was his art as well. Not just his Mobile's, you know, he's mobile. So he invented mobiles. And so those things that you see I mean you did he remind his artwork reminds me very much of Jean mirror and and some of the images I mean God, I'll just go this is again. I'll have to Google it and show you an image for call the you'll know I'll Chase it up but I went and saw the Marcel Duchamp showing me the other day. Yeah, that was pretty good. That was really good. Actually. I've been meaning to go and see it. How long is it going for? He kind of knew a little bit about Burma. But yeah, hang on. 

We're just stop. Is he telling you that or yeah, yeah. They came back as kind of servants. Oh, yeah house workers or whatever. You have a certain part of the wrong way to think about he's deaf. Did you thinking he was going to die young or anything like that or use this? You know, I don't know. I just think he overdosed on drugs I think was delivered. No, I don't either way looking into it and they'd given him a whole heap of concoctions and drugs that are were just if you mix them up. Yeah, they can they can basically you're sleeping you don't wake up when I knew him. He was taking lots of different drugs, you know, are you running recreational this? Yeah. He also got onto psychotic antipsychotics later on and that you know, they'll prescribe drugs. These are the ones I think that killed him wasn't smoking dope making dopamine that's not going to kill you. Yeah. With Miley Diapers at anything else because maybe you could only marry water I operate in being kept these off that incentive operating in circles like you that Maurice fluctuations photographer. Talk about how he liked to gamble and like hard kind of had other parts to he's life apart from just being a singer songwriter. Yeah, okay. All we could do is just see that the cafe in the Sun and yeah, okay chocolate or something and it's it's interesting. You're one of the few people alive. You actually saw him fly. Which is interesting. We actually play the cat. I got a couple of gigs together actually at the Troubadour We Fight Together. You played a couple of gigs at the Troubadour together. Yeah, that's interesting. I want what you came on and then he came on or you were both on stage together both of these together because she went a lot of these songs. I've heard interesting and I used to get the lyrics of them or have you still got copies of all those things or yeah, I think I'll show some of them here. Have you got anything that he brought might have written or anything? Everybody's handwriting know I could I wrote down from what he told me. Also some of the words that might have been included in his recording. 

Oh, yeah, they weren't recorded a recording. All right. Well River mean there's a whole versus versus heart that's missing from the and you pass that on to his family or anyone know the old if you want to pass it on to me at some stage we can yeah, I'd be interested to compare because yeah, I've been a long a long time fan of Nick Drake for over 15 years or so like many young. I mean on only 62, but I There's a lot of people who are fans of his music. Which I suppose at the time people didn't. Necessarily realize he wasn't very popular to time as you know, he's records didn't show very well. Yeah, and wasn't that popular. I mean, he wasn't a good performer. Yeah, because when he went to clubs, I've been to the same clubs and we both got on. Hey, didn't he very well. He was booked to play anywhere. He travels under your book but to promote his records, but generally he just turned up at a folk club and played if he was invited to like me. That that we you know each other he didn't have an ego. He didn't think I'm good. I should be this. I mean one of the summer one of these songs said that you know, yeah left me hanging on a star. Yeah, I deserve better but when you know any kind of didn't have that he wasn't pushing himself. Well suppose he would push himself by being there ready to put yeah, it's really pushing the stuff ready before but he wasn't commanding to performer, you know, yeah. Just make his presence felt. He just turned up at the club and Yeah, and then he will be any more love than it was. They didn't want me on either. Yeah, what I'm saying is right about as much chance again many vegans heeded. Yeah are you there was a probably a lot of people performers like that. Yeah, John Martin and all these others who were just struggling. Have you heard of Ralph? Mikkel? Yep. Yeah. He's never won Streets of London. Yeah. I am video. Well ride. Yeah, and of course Long John baldry was well named. Are you ever he was the electrical wasn't electric plane, but he played originally acoustic. 

Okay. Yeah, he played it cousins through the where we played like I wasn't smelly how big was the cousins have how many people could have fit in a small place if the snow bear is always packed because it was an ism easily the best folk Club in London at the time. So if you've got if they called you up, how many would you play two or three four songs or half an hour or well, as I said, I only played four to six songs. Yep, because I didn't want they didn't the by people on who just told this day. Yeah. Yeah, so I was good. So I just played it. That's 426 songs. And then we're off but I think that's why I always I did. Yep. That's right here. Guitar You know in between songs. Because he all that none of make songs that are play with Audrey tuning. They're all open tunings. Yep, which I forgot to mention which in fact they like John Martin. Got from going to Morocco. All right. Yeah, we're the the food you know that you did. Wow, after the Bob Dylan all of white. Oh, yeah. Okay, and I played early in the set, but it was actually in the Belgian border because they wouldn't allow it in France. And what did you just play acoustic? Yeah, I do sztyc. Yeah, actually Frank's never played there. Okay? Yeah. Well might just sit down here near never table. Yeah. Do you want a coffee or hot chocolate or something? You getting anything? Yeah. Yeah. I'm getting a hot chocolate the cappuccino cappuccino. Yeah, it'll be just here. We're just find a place where we can sit in the Sun. What we just did here. Yeah, it's where that lady was going to sit. All know that one of these days you will be right. Are you all going are you know? I did see your mind. They're very good. Thank you, which is just sit right over here in the sun. Yeah. Thanks a lot for that. I'm just interviewing him. So I've just Thanks a lot. Thanks. Give me the winter. So Anthony just asked me about getting a little brief bio. So what how would you say in two or three sentences that we can put down who and what you are for that article? Famous singers The great-grandnephew Oh Percy Grainger. 

Okay. Yep. Yep, and you've also been in the musician and what else have you done in your life? My first I did an apprenticeship sound making apprenticeship. I made sales and I had a sound like did this for some years but yourself the sales be honest. All right. Okay, and I cloud and I like I came third. Raisin toast in there so I don't think we got what you wanted. You want the butter? I'll get them. I asked the lady and she didn't know what the pain I rise on was clearly due to spring forward. The brothers already in there. Sorry, it's going with Hannah right on it means a circle of raisins. Yeah, and I think they just they are there. Did you it'll be there that day? Don't worry. It's okay. It doesn't matter. I couldn't climb that wall. Do you want to eat that or like, okay. So your style maker you're also a musician. Ended up in London in the late 40s a 1968. Yeah, Australia, I'd say the Pokemons and Sydney. Yep. Have you heard it Go system. Yep. I used to play the same clubs as Egypt and marionette innocent. Yep. So, why did you leave for Australia in 68? Hang on I'll get you a little you're right. Yes, I wanted you to leave because basically more with is how the hippie I suppose. Yeah, and I also wanted to be a musician and And it's really it wasn't not much was happening. Then everyone was going to London and yeah, well, you know that we're not sharpen Richard and everyone Felix Dennis and British Gary shed there. So when you arrived in London, what happened? Well before I were London, I went but it off the ship in South I went by ship. There's days where we got to Southampton the castle said look you should go to the Isle of Wight before all you people are out there. So I'm out there with Bob Dylan Bob Dylan olive oil. 

Well, so this is 69 what happened? 69. Oh, that was a good start to the trip. So you were at the Olive white concert in 1969. Yeah, Bob Dylan Hendrix with Hendrix there. No as the next year okay with Actually Hendrix died it's in room is lifted in a hospital in Samaria with Hospital in its Court. Are you you'd been in that room in the hospital? Yeah, I think he was dead by the time they got him to the hospital. You know, who else who was in the hospital at that time Bob Brown, you know the politician. Australian greens politician Bob Brown. You don't know he was a doctor serving in that hospital when they brought his body in so So 69 you arrived in London and you just started hanging around in music venues. Like we have people like Nick Drake and others weird. Yeah, like like the cousins thousand drifted off through the door then jeez. I had to store and so we stopped and played at at the real house at your farm. All right? Okay. What were you selling? Incense books Might my shoulder based on my shoulder base, okay. So you just started to think okay. I'll need to make some money to survive here. And and that was it where your what do you have a group of friends or were you by yourself? Where are you alone people in infringe magazine friends. So you got to say she what how come you're at. How come that happen? You just living near them or something because either still in the market underneath their offices and when it went broke, I took over the whole thing friends the ground floor all the ground floor. Okay, and that became your kind of shop did it? Yeah. I've been friends the magazine last year. I took care of the whole building that what was your shop called? Do you have a name or yeah sunflower sunflower if you got any pictures of it or any any memorabilia from that day and those days You can find it on the internet. I think I'm going to file I kept. I could send uvula yeah, that'll be good. I'll be good. 

Did you have who are the kind of customers? Lots of any famous customers or yeah. You should play something when I was in China. They were Germany should government became the opposition leader. They showed a shot of him in my shop buy a copy of the Communist Manifesto who of who Jeremy corbyn? Jeremy covered what they would that be I don't know. They didn't give the date. It would have been under I saw this one Chinese TV. CCTV is pretty shocked. So how long did your shop last till today? Throw that G2 to 1981, okay. And what did you do after that came back here to throw ya. Between 69 and 70 to up. I live in Hollywood lived in Holland. Like I say you weren't even though it's sometimes you're in London and seeing people like Nick Drake in that year of basically went and lived in Holland. Yeah, I wasn't I wasn't I was known for to you. That's right. I starved as in I think I'm going to hold it in 1970 yet one may be okay. 71 72 maybe I started the shop at 73. I'm not sure. Okay. Yeah. That's interesting. Why did you go to Holland for well, I haven't. Dad's girlfriend, okay. When a child that child mummy the key married somebody else but I got a job there for looking as a sound like it so you had a child with her. Yeah, okay. And then after that what that broke down and you went back to London and sell the shop. Okay, and how did the shop go good? Yes. I went to Holland a few times out there because I made friends it will I was in a home with with somebody who ran a book A book wholesale this moment, okay. Sunflower, so you would bite you with basically a Bookshop was it? The only book shop. I could draw it, but I also sell incense in a children's. Yep bombs and is like a headshot. 

Did you have records Hozier posters and stuff like that regulars we have posters and I also make canvas shoulder bangs Okay, Mason had to say machine the front of the window just so did you work the shop yourself or you have people helping you and Every now and then I'd stop particularly on the weekends. Yeah, that's nice. What about yeah, you're right. What about performing? Did youdid you still perform at all or you're too busy with the shop? I'm only perform in the first year when I was in London. Okay, and when I yeah I afterwards. About the time Nick Drake died. I'm sort of Performing again mainly because I didn't want people to forget his songs. All right, so did you perform some of his songs to keep did you play them? Yeah, that's interesting the did, you know work out his style of playing did you what he showed me? He should be the tunings doing the song. Oh, wow, and the words. What about he's playing Tech. What was he's playing technique like Do you have long fingernails? Did he play over the whole Sound Hole? Did he have dead strings? Did he he he's playing style classic like I couldn't do that. I could play the chords and get the shootings but he start with me start with more with the sort of halfway between jazz and classical as you can tell by the record. Oh, yes. Yes. So you say you you learn to pay the basic chords and everything? Yeah, but he he when he played them live. He had a lot more. He had a lot more in his playing then you could do. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. What was he recognized by people as a good player at the time he's peers. So excited The not Grant because there's a lot of good at guitars around. Yeah. I mean it was a peak period wasn't it is because they moved the method tells us what that was. 

It was Al Stewart with playing else do it. Yeah the cat I mean even people like Jimmy Page. Yeah ran born John renbourn him, but yet Burt Yanks. Someone Frank's someone Frank 30 eggs was a big with a big one. Yeah, John Martin was a friend of his who later because Nick Drake died in 74. But you didn't see much after that first period when you meet new indeed you did you say came into your shop once you did? Yeah, what was that about? He went to see I think was the he's sound engineer. We lived on a hill day Notting Hill gate. Yes. Or it might have been the dealer he would drugs from in time what he just dropped in to say hello. Did he? What do you want to drink, but I didn't have time. I was busy serving people. And when I had to tell me was it God he walked away. Did he within that time where he looked pretty dishevelled and all or it was yeah. Never struck me. He looking look very disheveled. And that would have been just not long before he died a year or so before he died you think I think I did a few months before he died. Okay, that was close was he? Oh, that's a shame that you didn't have that chance to speak during that last time. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, well, if you've got some of those words you think of some of his songs that people might know about I think that would be interesting to let me know about and we could I don't know about about copyright that well. Basically it's with the family. So all that all that you do is you don't you know, we could say here's some of the songs and then they'd be part of the copyright of the family whoever owns the copyright on that but they don't have the complete something that really got the recorded. Yeah. So what it what are you worried about in the guards to copyright? Well It's an interesting thing. You want a patient out after I was good. I'm the only person he's got these versions, okay. All right. 

Well if ever you want to do anything with them I can let me know. I can also ask at our copyright officer here to say where does it stand where? Someone has written a song or someone has and it hasn't been copyrighted but someone has written down verses of what they've sung who owns the copyright. That's the question, isn't it? Because he Hey buddy, where he did the versions of songs that were the ones you've recorded? Yeah, sorry and how many of these kind of variation would you have just a couple or? I'm not sure that maybe that's six, right? Okay, that's interesting. Well, look, if you ever did let me see them. I wouldn't do anything with them. Okay, I would just keep it to myself. And then it's up to you. I just I'm an archivist. So I'm always worried about things disappearing things being destroyed things like that. So if you want to just let me know and I can so you know that someone's got him if something happens to you, for example, because I'm I don't I don't want to do anything with them apart from eventually let people know that they're out there but that's the you've got to deal with it other copyright issue, which I understand, you know, yeah so I could just be like a backup for you if you if you if you want and as I say I wouldn't do anything with them. I wouldn't do anything. It'll my own songs. I translations. Of travel refills. Yeah, you're saying that have you have all your songs been published etcetera. What's going to happen with them? You have you got family? You said you had a Sunday. 

Do I want to do a story here the daughter here? No, I so she's got some she'll want to know what's going on with anything. Yeah. Okay, like I say, I'm happy to help for example. If you if you if there was a song like River man, I could go through all the known versions. I that I've come across over time and see if if there'd been any cuz it wasn't only the LP version. There's also BBC recordings that have floated up of him live. If one of him where they've got him playing with a man I think with the Tableau and also a flute so there's a few of those things going around. So maybe some of those words might have been there or they might the beam so, you know, it's interesting we go. Miss you buddy. He prayed he decided to play continuously and huh. Yeah, I mean a lot of these songs are very well. Well formed and there's various versions of them than but you say he could spontaneously create songs and yeah and play and what each time he played in my to played the song a bit differently. That's right. Yeah amazing. Yeah. Sorry seems like a really interesting character both personally, but also musically yeah, yeah. All right. Not many people got her name because he was shy lazy. Yeah, he wasn't what you call sociable. But he did have Circles of friends didn't eat. Did he have friends? Well, it is a new Drummer Martin a bit. I saw him talking to John Martin. I think you live with your mother for a while. You never went to parties and saw him there or anything like that. Whenever I saw him he was on his own. Yeah, I mean it's amazing that he produced those. You know, those first two albums and then Pink Moon. I mean he had a lot of talent. Yeah regards to His musical side The question always have is ours is you know, why what happened to him? Why was he so why did he fail as a performer? Why did he you know, what was why was he so shy why did he have problems with being a performer? I mean most people will get up there and say well I got four songs to seeing I'm going to play them but as you say he'd get there and eat he be tuning he wouldn't be talking to the audiences. Yeah, and they just start to ignore him of it. Yeah. Well, they lose interest when you yeah tuning and you're not talking or singing lessons interest you you didn't you weren't one of the big concerts. 

He was that like Queen Elizabeth hall or whatever, you know, he did one or two of those where we went really? Well, it's record company. I think arrange that yeah, did you ever say other performers like Tim Buckley or anyone? I think we should invest in them because yeah, I still miss it. And because I told you I the store at The Roundhouse leads to go to The Roundhouse regularly anyway as well as the folk clubs. Did you see Hendrix or anyone or cream or any of those bands? I was mainly the acoustic that you're interested in. I saw Jess, right? Oh, all right there and and pentangle which was badly burnt yet. Yep. Hey guys, so I thought maybe you had Japanese Led Zeppelin early on. And I also hope that many times for Point. Yeah, because I used to because our friends of mine. Nick the SEC saxophone guy and let me let me in for Motorhead. Yep friends of mine. I used to go Uncle coming to my shop. Oh, yeah. And you have time when you started to know the people that were coming into your shop. And yeah, well a lot of them will be Visions look at and use a bill from the pink fairies or Quinn's. So why why musicians why did I why did the musicians like your shop because of well biggest II I had a lot of bootlegs. All right, and I was underneath friends magazine. Okay, we're up there. Are you part of the counterculture? Yeah. It's right and I sell children's and things. It's him the book my canvas bags, but but but I I had a lot of big leg but you couldn't get yeah and including Bob Dylan's with from great right white Wonder. Yeah, the basement tapes basement tapes. Well that was wasn't just a patient over there other ones there to other things and that's why people musicians like let me in all the come along. Advisor belly he lived on the premises, right? This could came. They're actually. All right. You met him did you? Yeah, I knew you knew quite well when he was before he was David Bowie now before you think he started after noon. How come you knew him? Well, did you biggest he lived in that building when I first had a strong there? Where was the building at? What was this? 

Again? 05 Portobello road. We have five, Portobello Road. Well, it was two buildings 3050387 and you ended up kind of running the whole building. Did you when 305 you rented it? I took over 305. Okay. Don't rock the got three I said that was Okay. Yep. Famous song by Cat Stevens their Portobello road. Yeah, but it might be the other end. It wasn't far from that from it was the filthy from the Railway Bridge. The other show up in the other Corner was cool because the junk shop. So this this 3052307 was it a two-story three-story ice moon door. It had a basement but it was the shop floor. Then there's the first floor that three floors that was three floors are okay and you live there as well. What what what I figure I right I lived there. I went friends moved out. I took care of their offices. And David Bowie was there for a while as well. You thought that everybody was there when I first came there he wasn't there when I took over the bill because he moves that long before then. I think he lives somewhere in South London that I think he lived in a big house is something here. Yeah. That was when I knew he wasn't famous Davy Jones. He wasn't able to Jay's yeah, okay. Oh, that's interesting. So it must have been interesting to for an Australian to rock up in the middle of London at that time and just have all this activity going on. So you're pretty happy you you ended up there. Yeah. Well you see I'm I'd played in clubs here. We've got the club's it. I played at a place called the shack and they will have you heard of that and I played it a couple of clubs up other Kings Cross and and the Troubadour in the In New South Head Road, just before he Two reps to double by I don't obey whether your Club is where they wear. This is where should this stadium is just possibly Stadium. There's a pivotal Club. They are play there to the three Gary. She is to the Mary Henderson Clay. Did you say Bob Dylan when he came to Australia in 66 I did. Yeah. I saw him. I throw about all three times. Actually that was just really Stadium. Yep. So the Beatles the saw the Beatles at the end. There's actually a recording of Dylan at the Sydney Stadium. Yeah. I had I sell copies that my shop in London. Yeah, that's good. Yeah, the the the first IP come on acoustic in the second half he bring his band on. Yeah, Robbie Robinson and all that. Yeah, okay. So your music is obviously been important part of your life. What so many people in the 60s and yeah any young people wasn't it? Yeah, okay. Well, that's probably all for now. Yeah, I I could have done it every second legal Christie Christie. Have you got a minute? This is a man who had a shop in London in 1969 and guess who one of his customers was let me off walk win. I'm a big fan Christy Works in library. She plays bass and yeah, I'm just he's just telling me about being in London and friends with David David Bowie and what slay me you got her head shop. Yeah. Yeah books. I sell books records Bootleggers bootleg canvas bag. It sounds amazing. What if you got do you want - for the global climate strike? 

So they're doing a strike to basically all the things about of the bottom. So just drop your dining mind going in transferred Renewables built in sustainable jobs. Well, I don't believe that they will want to do anything about it. But I think that's the purpose of this drag is to demonstrate a lot of public support for taking climate change. Really seriously Roth was telling me about in 69 when he was sitting down with Nick Drake talking about environmental issues. Well, you know, I sold in my shop Silent Spring by Rachel Carson, you know the cylons. Yes. Yes and and the guy hypothesis. Yeah. I saw the fear of God in her book because it doesn't matter because it's a conversation with Nick and I have often had but other things as well and Have you ever heard of the old straight track know there used to be people are used to study Ley lines and my lines. Yeah, and I got called Watkins wrote. This book called The Old straight track of that Ley lines and standing Stone. I went to all these places Stonehenge and all that cause they didn't and then the audiologist beautiful ones. Actually. There's rumors that there is a crossing point underneath long actually of Ley lines here in Wollongong. So you're in a special place. Yeah, he's got a lot of lot of memories there. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, the environment is the new issue not for me, but I don't believe it is. I mean, I wish people had been listening to you know, yeah back then well Tolkien used to talk to his trees are used to hug the new he like like trees moving people. Sisto that to at the group consciousness of trays is amazing. Yeah, and and I remember get with guy with Nick and sitting in Hampstead Heath listening to trace over here. 

Who did he take you there or you took him there? I think he took me there because he lived for a while up here. Yeah. Yeah. Well that's amazing. He used to like to sit at the picture of him. Just sitting under the tree playing yeah. Did he did you sit there and play or you just listen future digitally the trees that's that's wonderful. Yeah. Yeah because it's quite a special place hamster. They think yeah. I've never been I've never been there special place. All right Ross. I better get going. Sorry. That's right. See you later. Well, I guess you want to get on the bus now. Well, it must be getting there. 

He was going to put under pressure the 60 hit it. Oh Bonnie bubbles was I mean, he was an artist what did you know him for his posters or he's record covers because he came here myself. He was a friend of mine. Okay, then I guess I got to name these artwork because he used to design covers 4984444. Hawkwind knowledge. Okay, he did all those like in search of space and all that great albums left.